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"Cruiser Class"

Postby Guest on Sun Feb 26, 2006 5:48 pm

I note for recent experiences with the NS 14 fleet they have introducd a "Cruiser Class" at some championships aimed at getting older boats and heavy crews into a competitive environment.

This concept is also now in place at some triathlons with a category where competitors are ranked by their weight and compete against other competitors of similar weight.

At 85 kgs plus it is difficult to be competitive even at a young age unless conditions are totally suited to the heavy sailor. This is in my opinion is a disadvantage of the Sabre.

Has there ever been any thought to introducing a "Cruiser Class" concept to Sabre's? I know we have divisions based on age but I see from results that some of those who win outright don't need their age categorisation.

:?:
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Postby matt westland on Wed May 03, 2006 7:02 pm

Re Cruiser class

At first thought this seems a good idea. It might help get some of the heavier sailors sailing again. However comparing it with the NS14 doesnt seem valid. They have this group due to the design development aspect of the class ie older boats are just slow and have lost their value as top boats. This allows budget sailing in the cruiser class which is a good thing. The Sabre differs in that it is much more a one design. A 10 year old boat which is minimum weight and well built ie no bumps will be just as fast as a brand new Sabre.
When it comes to skipper weight the Sabre is quite weight tolerant as you can buy fatter sails to suit heavier skippers unlike other boats like Lasers which have a very limited weight range. The current OZ champ is over 80 kg and seems to go okay.
Maybe a cruiser class for Sabres ought be the combined weight of skipper and boat. Say 45kg for boat and 85 for skipper giving a Cruiser class for over 130s. Then again Sabre sailors don't seem to care much for complicated stuff.

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Postby peter reid on Wed May 03, 2006 10:49 pm

People can say what they like everybody is entitled to their opinion and i respect them for it but nothing will convince me otherwise than a new sabre in its first year has a huge advantage over older sabres- i have formed this opinion having been in the class since 1985-this i think is especially relevent in 0-15 knots perhaps a shade less in over 15 where boat handling is more relevant- sure you will say the most skilled sailors generally make up the top ten in a championship and the neophites make up the last ten i agree- but my point is that say excluding really stand out sailors like Wayne Bates in my opinion not much separates the skills of the sailors in the various groups like 1-10,10-20,20-30 and so on,within these groups over say a 7 race series i think a one year old boat versus a 7 year old boat could account for being at either end of this spectrum-i can not prove it-it is just based on personal observation-well does this mean i should buy a new sabre every year- no way, there are more important things than winning-i enjoy sailing sabres,i have made great friends and i enjoy travelling to places around this country of ours to sail in championships-sailing has got to be fun-that is more impotant than anything
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Postby fitzwarryne on Sun Jul 02, 2006 10:06 pm

The cruiser division in the NS14s is self selected not according to the age of the boat. The results are based on handicap not scratch, so if you enter with a new boat there is no advantage. In addition they have a heavyweight division which is a scratch event.

The Tasars have age of crew categories like the Sabres, that works well.

The Flying Fifteens has three fleets depending on the age of the boat, which while a 'one design' hull, over the years people have learnt to optimize the shape within the tolerances. Another Sabre attribute, but I think like with Lasers, the hull gets tired with advancing age rather being slower compared to new boats benefiting from minor shape improvements.

The Mirrors seem to have prizes for every catergory of boat and crew which keeps the whole fleet happy.

The question is whether the fleet is racing to be top dog, or the majority are in it to have fun. My view is a single scratch and handicap system is the ideal solution plus a single prize for extreme categories on a scratch basis. such over 70, over 85kg. This year I have been race officer for three nationals and several state titles, and know the happiest prize-giving is with a few random prizes thrown in:- best capsize, most attractive colour scheme. etc.
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Postby GuestMember on Mon Jul 03, 2006 4:02 pm

Actually the Vic States had an over 85 kilo class last year specifically targeted at this area.

As it turns out the regatta was nice and windy so being 85+ was a bonus for a change.
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