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Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine?

Postby Aten on Thu Nov 07, 2013 1:04 pm

Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine?

Craig
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Re: Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine

Postby GuestMember on Thu Nov 07, 2013 1:11 pm

Aten wrote:Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine?

Craig


LOL :roll: You are joke, I hope??
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Re: Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine

Postby Aten on Thu Nov 07, 2013 1:42 pm

Nope. Serious question. There seems to be a demand for expensivef ibreglass boats.
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Re: Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine

Postby Aten on Thu Nov 07, 2013 2:23 pm

What I am getting at is that there has been lots discussion on the pros and cons of moulded fibreglass boats compared to the current plywood variety. Most of these arguements are valid but no one seems to have discussed the issue of why the sabre rules should change to accommodate this. The fact is that there are many classes of boat that are already constructed in fibreglass so if you want a fibreglass boat go sail one. The Sabre is a beautiful boat in plywood and that is what it makes it so good. Why f**k with it. Why does the Sabre have to "keep up with the times"? I am sure most would agree with me on this.
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Re: Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine

Postby GuestMember on Thu Nov 07, 2013 3:37 pm

I do agree with you.

I have owned both wooden and fibreglass and although I love the wood, the low maintanence of the fibreglass suits me much better.
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Re: Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine

Postby Daen on Thu Nov 07, 2013 6:12 pm

I assume this is a rhetorical question, since the lion's share of boats built since sail number 1800 or so would probably be glass, and my new number is 1979 so that is quite a lot! Obviously people do want glass boats and this seems to have coincided with a boom in class numbers.

As someone who is new to the Sabre, the availability of good quality glass boats (which are pretty much identical) was one of the main reasons to join the class. Wooden boats are actually very expensive in terms of the time commitment (I'd rather spend my time sailing than gluing and varnishing), and unless very well maintained they do not last as long. Less than half the cost of my new boat is in the hull anyway, so for someone like me who doesn't have time to spend winter building a wooden boat (even if I had the space to do it in!), there would be little difference in cost for a boat that does not last as long. I do agree that the wooden boats are beautiful, and that is always still an option.

And since every ply boat is a one-off, that is actually a lot more likely to lead to variations as people manipulate the tolerances. Taking a mould off a proven boat and making well-built versions available in glass is, in my view, a very good thing for the class and flattens the playing field.
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Re: Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine

Postby Aten on Thu Nov 07, 2013 7:47 pm

Apart from a varnish every 2-3 years does a wood boat take more time to maintain?
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Re: Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine

Postby Greg on Thu Nov 07, 2013 8:13 pm

There is obviously a lot of feeling out there which is good to see as things have been a bit quiet on this forum.

It seems that the main issue against the fibreglass boats is the associated cost. I think that Daen makes a good point that less than half the cost of a new boat is in the hull.

I hope that many of the currently proposed rule changes relating to fit out are successful. Allowing the use of standard fittings rather than custom mast steps, towel rails will do a lot to bring down the cost of new boats.

Something is wrong with our class when a fitted out boom costs more than twice that of a laser and a fitted out mast cost more than 1k.

Cheers

Greg
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Re: Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine

Postby Aten on Fri Nov 08, 2013 10:16 am

If people are paying over $1000 for a mast I'm in the wrong business. Too many cheque book sailors!
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Re: Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine

Postby Daen on Fri Nov 08, 2013 12:22 pm

It's cheaper if you fit it out yourself, but compared to many other classes it is about par for the course. A laser mast is about $650 or so, and is a simpler section with no stays or halyard. And even at $1k it is about a quarter of the price of the carbon masts used in some other singlehanders!
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Re: Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine

Postby Matt02 on Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:53 pm

There are pros and cons for both.
Fiber glass you can build lighter and stiffer. When the boat gets older you have to take in the account of repairs that add wight ect.
From boat building repairs glass boats are eaiser to repair on the spot and quick repair to keep you on the water.

Timber boats are nice to sail, look at. But when doing repairs you have to dry the timber out and use timber glues which take time to dry. Over years the timber does take on water making the boat heavy if not sealed ect. Down the track like 30 years rhe boat becomes rotten and un repairable, where fibreglass will become soft but you can still sail them with out breaking apart

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Re: Why do we want glass boats when ply boats work just fine

Postby JCampbell on Sun Jul 29, 2018 8:14 pm

Craig asks why sabre rules should change to accommodate fibreglass boats. Fibreglass boats will be the logical choice for most however some like the challenge of building their own boat and like the visual appeal of the timber. Also there is the price saving if you have the time to devote to building. If Aten is referring to the rules that came into effect on Feb 1 this year, these are not about fibreglass boats but more about allowing timber boats to be competitive and also to limit further shape evolution. I have only been involved in the class for 10 years and I was attracted to it because I had the choice to build my own boat. However, I believe that it is impossible to build a competitive timber boat without altering the hull panels by more than what could be considered amateur builder tolerance and certainly more than what a professional could manage. So one intention of the new rules is to more accurately define the hull shape through the measurement of more sections and not rely on adherence to panel shape. A lot of work was done to develop the new rules and significant work has been done since to ensure that the current fibreglass boats represent the maximum amount of optimisation that can be achieved within the rules. I hope the new rules will allow timber boats to be built with the perceived or real performance benefits of fibreglass. There is no reason to change the Sabre at this time. The only reasons why change should be considered include cost and availability of construction materials. These are my views only!
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